Can I do this with my engine and the starter?

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Apr 01, 2008 18:11:14
KLUTZ

As the engine sit here out of the car,



Is it possible and if so, safe to connect the starter to a battery to turn the engine over to see if everything is moving correctly up top? If so, how would I do it?

Paul

Apr 01, 2008 18:16:49
John D. Weimer

Sit it on wood blocks under the edge of the pan or hook you lift to the top so it can't tip over and you're good to go ahead and run it by the starter.





Apr 01, 2008 18:17:55
twigworker

Absolutely! In fact, it you want to take the time to hang the carbs and the exhaust manifold on it and fill the float chambers with gasoline you can start the thing and let it run for a half a minute or so just sitting there. Noisy and a bit scary the first time you do it but it is certainly possible.

Jack

Apr 01, 2008 18:18:16
brian70mgb

i dont see why you cant ......ive watched John Twist do it on some of his videos on youtube, he has a barell full of water hooked up for the coolant and a hose hooked up to the exhaust and a small lawn mower gas tank to gravity feed the carbs with some blocks of wood to steady the motor...all you need is a battery to power the coil and dizzy and starter

Apr 01, 2008 18:19:04
KLUTZ

Thanks John. So, the Neg. on the small male tab and pos on the top bolt on the starter? I can't remember since it has been a while.

Apr 01, 2008 18:20:29
brian70mgb

go to youtube and search universitymotorstld and find one of Johns vids he does it with a couple motors on there

Apr 01, 2008 18:20:35
KLUTZ

Now you guys are making it a BIG test. :)

Apr 01, 2008 18:20:59
KLUTZ

brian70mgb Wrote:

Quote: "
go to youtube and search universitymotorstld and find one of Johns vids he does it with a couple motors on there
"



K

Apr 01, 2008 18:40:44
Norm

I was thinking the same thing.. Here it is, a TC engine test at University Motors.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MvMlSrleLS0

Norm

Apr 01, 2008 18:43:32
John D. Weimer

Negative on the engine anywhere. Positive to big stud on starter. Bridge from big stud to the little tab with a screwdriver or something to activate the starter.

Apr 01, 2008 18:49:28
gooser

if all he wants to see is if everything is moving correctly on top why not just turn the engine with a socket. will do a lot less damage if everything is not moving ok. zero chance of starting a fire.

Apr 01, 2008 19:04:17
lbcnut

gooser Wrote:

Quote: "
if all he wants to see is if everything is moving correctly on top why not just turn the engine with a socket. will do a lot less damage if everything is not moving ok. zero chance of starting a fire.
"


Where is the fun, excitement, and danger in that? Paul has been snowed in all winter. Give him a chance to live a little.

Apr 01, 2008 19:06:43
John D. Weimer

Besides that the oil pump can't prime and squirt oil all over that garage if you turn it by hand. I was lookiing forward to a post about that.

Apr 01, 2008 19:45:25
JimmyHilton

Or blowing the rear welch plug just after getting everything running well.

Apr 01, 2008 20:02:02
ingoldsb

I really can't go along with the idea of starting an engine that isn't bolted down. If the throttles open even a little, the torque will send a 300+ lb engine dancing around the garage. If you want to start it, build an engine stand.

With the plugs out you would easily spin it fast enough with the starter (or even a drill on the crankshaft bolt - might be hard on the drill, though) to prime the engine. Most of us do it that way when we put the engine back in the car.

Apr 01, 2008 20:46:51
sweep

It's a pity you're not closer, I planned to do this and even built the stand to suit. Turned out that the engine was so crap that I ended up doing a complete rebuild.
The engine stand was handy while I attached the gearbox and other bits but I never ended up using the stand to run the motor. After the rebuild and assembly I put it back in the car and it's first run was from there.
There is a thread about July last year when I asked the same question if you want to go looking.
But now the stand is just taking up space along with the rotisserie and the other engine stand.

http://s114.photobucket.com/albums/n255/sweep_2006/Engine%20stand/



Chris

Apr 01, 2008 20:52:05
mac townsend

more than just a few seconds without water jacket, though, and you risk real damage. I ruined a Datsun 1300 engine that way in less than 2 minutes. rig a water feed (a barrel plumbed to the bottom hose and then the top hose back to the barrel)

and the ground will be important..grounding the engine.

Apr 01, 2008 21:15:38
Lamb-Man

sweep Wrote:

Quote: "
It's a pity you're not closer, I planned to do this and even built the stand to suit.
"


Dood, Nice camo job :thumbsup:

Apr 01, 2008 22:44:45
sweep

Lamb-Man Wrote:

Quote: "
sweep Wrote:Quote:
It's a pity you're not closer, I planned to do this and even built the stand to suit.
Dood, Nice camo job
"


It's what I had and I wanted something on the welds.

Chris

Apr 02, 2008 06:59:49
bk

ingoldsb Wrote:

Quote: "
I really can't go along with the idea of starting an engine that isn't bolted down. If the throttles open even a little, the torque will send a 300+ lb engine dancing around the garage. If you want to start it, build an engine stand.
With the plugs out you would easily spin it fast enough with the starter (or even a drill on the crankshaft bolt - might be hard on the drill, though) to prime the engine. Most of us do it that way when we put the engine back in the car.
"


Started a few of em just sitting on the floor with no stand. They don't dance around like you think as there is no load on the engine make it torque up. Just don't run em but a minuite or two to keep from overheating. Scares the heck out of someone who's never seen it done, they have visions of the engine taking off across the room like in a cartoon.
Bill

Apr 02, 2008 07:15:38
B-racer

I'm guessing by the pics you have a digital camera, so by all means video record your experience for us! :)

Apr 02, 2008 08:03:31
ingoldsb

Quote: "
Started a few of em just sitting on the floor with no stand. They don't dance around like you think as there is no load on the engine make it torque up.
"


What you say is true as long as the engine speed doesn't change rapidly. If that happens, the engine torques against the flywheel and you'll get the dance. So - as long as the throttle is steady you should be fine - but if the throttle falls open then you will get a net torque.

Now - if we were really interested in this poor fellow's welfare we would get out the physics books and figure out the effective torque given the rate of angular acceleration available from a B series engine. You may be completely right and it may be low enough that the engine won't dance. But I still wouldn't take a chance (but like Jeff says, please video tape it! :) )

Duh - the effective torque is clearly less than the engine torque against a brake, so it can't be any worse than 110 ft lbs. That is worst case - it won't be that much against the flywheel. I guess you're right - it *probably* won't dance.

Apr 02, 2008 08:53:56
KLUTZ

Ummmm..

Thanks for all the responses, but... I am NOT going to start it. All I want to do is have it spin faster then I can spin it via a ratchet and socket.
Working for three days so it will wait 'till the weekend.

Paul

Apr 02, 2008 08:57:21
The Wiz

KLUTZ Wrote:

Quote: "
Ummmm..
Thanks for all the responses, but... I am NOT going to start it. All I want to do is have it spin faster then I can spin it via a ratchet and socket.
Working for three days so it will wait 'till the weekend.
Paul
"



Chicken. :D

Apr 02, 2008 09:32:22
Ryan Reis

I dare you. DO IT, DO IT, DO IT, DO IT!!!

Apr 02, 2008 09:46:31
KLUTZ

WHO YOU CALLIN' CHICKEN????????

:X

:D


I would have to put ALL the crap back on it to do that. Don't suggest starting it again. :)

Apr 02, 2008 09:54:45
The Wiz

You're going to have to put it all back on at some point anyway, and it's a lot easier with the engine out of the car. :)

Please note, I did not actually suggest starting it. :D

Apr 02, 2008 10:41:22
pgawan2be

Ryan Reis Wrote:

Quote: "
I dare you. DO IT, DO IT, DO IT, DO IT!!!
"


I double dog dare you to. You can't turn down a double dog dare...

Apr 02, 2008 10:43:57
KLUTZ

Maybe I will lug it down to Ancaster in a few weeks, and we can giver her a go then. :)
Of course, it would have to take up Mary's seat in the "B"

Paul

Apr 02, 2008 11:09:49
Ryan Reis

Maybe I'm imagining this, but I seem to remember someone posting a pic on here a few years ago of an mg engine in the passenger seat of his corvette.

Apr 02, 2008 11:59:16
thomasbenham

I gotta get mine back together 'cause I wanna do it too!!!

Apr 02, 2008 12:09:40
The Wiz

I used to run Beetle engines on the floor all the time, their centre of gravity is a little lower but they never showed any signs of moving even when revved.

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