OD transmission thrust washer - here's where it gets weird

OK, so I posted here where I found bits of a bronze thrust washer in the screen of the LH OD.

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So I am disassembling the OD and I get the halves separated and look into the flywheel thinger, looking for the remnants of the thrust washer and I see this:

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It looks to me like there is a brand new thrust washer in there! According to my diagrams and parts lists, the thrust washer is directly behind the unidirectional clutch. There it is!

Now what. Should I just button it back up and go? Everything else looks good, sun and planetary gears are clean and not worn, sun gear and clutch material looks fine.

According to infomation given to me by the mechanic that rebuilt the O/D tranny in the 71 I had there are two thrust washers and only one is shown in the Moss Cat. and Bentley's Book. He was the transmission mechanic for the local dealership until it closed. He showed me where both washers went but it has been 9 yrs ago and my memory it not good enough to try to tell you. After my rebuild the tranny worked flawless. He had a machine shop make the second thrust washer and said that every transmission he has seen (rebuilt) the thrust washer was broken. He said it was because the factory scored the washers every 90 degrees thus making it weaker so he has the machinist score it only 3 times equally spaced instead of 4 times.

This is a blue label transmission

do not button it up until a couple of folks who have been into a blue label overdrive chime in.

OK
This is the first time I've heard there are TWO thrust washers in the unit.

Is this where the other thrust washer goes??

I only remember one brass thrust washer from when I rebuilt my black label OD but I did dig up a pic which shows one there.

Another pic that might help. This pic was from disassembly.

Thanks Norm.

There is no damned way I am going to pay $24 for a tiny ring of bronze. That's just ridiculous.

Scott, If I am not mistaken I had a Blue Label O/D. It had O/D in both 3rd & 4Th gear.

scottydawg Wrote:

I'll find something else. Or I'll make it myself.

I think I have one around somewhere, If you want, I'll send it to you if I can find it. It was just slightly worn.

I don't believe it, but I found it. Shoot me a PM with your address and I'll drop it in the mail.

Norm

Scott, there is only one thrust washer, and it appears to be there in the right place in your photos. Try turning the sprag clutch a bit to confirm that you see the reliefs that should be cut into the thrust washer - I can't see them in your photo.

If it's indeed there, then what you found in the screen is old debris that may have found it's way there after the thing was replaced. Could be whoever replaced it couldn't find all the pieces of the old one, or didn't bother.

Norm Wrote:

Those broken bits you removed don't look like the OD thrust washer. The size and curvature is wrong, and the reliefs would be at 90deg intervals.

scottydawg Wrote:

Part 20 in the diagram:

Gerald,

I believe the component you are looking at is for Black label ODs, I think they went with a glued-in piece of crap for the Blue Label ODs.

I still haven't found the rest of the washer though... that makes me a little nervous.

Sounds like your having some fun, Scott. :D

BLEARGH!!!
;)

scottydawg Wrote:

Gerald O Wrote:

call john at quantummechanics tomorrow. he'll hook you up with the right part. that's where i got my sun wheel bushing.

That picture is correct! It is where the thrust washer goes - and it is glued in place on the later transmissions. Yes, there are TWO thrust washers in an O/D unit - the other one rarely gives trouble, and is difficult to get at - it is also a different size.

On earlier units the washer we are concerned with is a press fit bushing - and never causes problems. The "best" repair is to have Quantumechanics refit your housing with the pressed in version. However, I have been running a loose one in this location for several years with no problems - but be sure to find one of the correct dimensions - and have the face in the housing machined flat if it is scored.

Picture shows the two types of housing - the one on the left has the "loose" thrust washer like you have, the one on the right is the pressed in version!



HTH

Would it be a bad idea to press in a steel bushing?

Yes! Steel-on-steel does not make for a good bearing surface. You need something relatively soft - bronze or brass are common.

What about copper? Too soft?

You can get a variety of generic bronze flat-washer type bearings at the local ACE hardware store. If you have a lathe it would be a quick job to turn one to the right dimensions then glue it in with JB weld.

I couldn't find anything large enough at Ace or Lowe's.

Does anyone know where I can find the tool for removing the OD oil pump? It's some weird spanner.

Scott,
They have them at Fastenal.


http://www.fastenal.com/web/products/detail.ex?sku=0281896

Jeez.

Anyone got one I can borrow or rent?

go get some drill shanks that fit the holes
use an adjustable wrench (farmer fix)

Get two short bolts that just fit the holes - then use a bar in between them! Works for me! (Steel rods are even better)

I tried that... almost lost a finger when the bolts bent and slipped out.

Limey - That's a wonderful post showing the exact issue. Thanks!

I used a punch out of a harbor freight punch kit and a hammer to encourage it out. Worked great.