Moss supercharger vs Judson

My car has a recently rebuilt early 5 main 1800 engine in it. Recently I've been day-dreaming about adding a supercharger. That lead me to wondering, if I was to do it, should I choose a period correct Judson or a modern Moss unit? Which would you choose and why?

Andy, this is always an interesting question. Very similar to 'should I put in a Sierra 5 speed, or an MG O/D box', or 'how would these wheels (from a Volvo/BMW/Fiat....) look on my MGA'....anyway, as we say in BC, chacoun a son gout, or, pardon my English, 'everyone to their own taste'. As long as you asked, here is my take: These cars (and I got a bunch) all have their goofy quirks, which to me makes them very interesting to experience. I would never install anything that was not available in period, because I like all the frustrations that come along with experiencing these cars as they were. I like racing them, don't care where I finish, as long I'm going reasonably well, as if it was back in the day. I don't need roller rockers, titanium axles, etc. No problem with guys wanting to make their cars as bullet-proof as possible with new stuff, they probably want the classic look without the quirks. Great. Just not me. When you go to a car show, and pop the hood, what will you be most proud to show: a nice old quirky Judson, or a nice new Moss unit. Your choice. While I am on the subject, my experience with Judsons is that many guys have heard about them. Lots of guys think they know about them. Very few have them. Fewer have installed them. Nobody I know has raced with one....except stupid me. At Seattle International many years ago, I was pedalling down the main straight, and heard a tremendous BANG. I looked around, car seemed to be OK, everyone else seemed OK, kept going. After the race, I lifted the hood to discover one of the 2 belts driving the Judson had disappeared. No problem, being the prepared racer boy that I was, I put the spare belt on. Next day, flat out down the main straight, the car seemed a bit sluggish. No go above 6000 rpm, but running OK. After the race I lifted the hood.....no belts. It had run with just the little 1" Holley, no drive to the Judson. So there you go, a nice story about a goofy, quirky Judson. RZ.

Andy

Judson, I had one. More period accessory, also more antiquated with the oiler, neat valve cover, etc. When set up works fine.

Moss, do not own one. New technology, bolt up and go. In theory should be more reliable.

Cost, if you can find a Judson and need to rebuild it the cost is probably similar to a new one, maybe a little less.

If I wanted to drive the car every day I would probably buy a Moss one.

Just my opinion.

Ron

Sheesh Rocket, in recent years I have avoided going across the BC border which is only 1 mile away. But now realize I will have to relearn Canadian before I go up there again!

John L.

Like, eh?

On the other hand 90% of the people at car shows think my

Moss blower is original.

That same 90% will see the Judson blower on Ralphie's TD and say

"Gee that blower must make your car go really, really fast!":)

Bottom line is do it for yourself.

Assuming I could find a rebuilt Judson for about the same price as a new Moss supercharger, that'd eliminate any concerns about initial cost or availability.

To me, the main allure of a Judson is the extra 'coolness' factor of having a fairly rare, vintage performance accessory. On the negative side, I've heard that they can be difficult to set up correctly, that they can be noisy (rattle), and that there might be fitment issues with the 18GB engine.

On the other hand, I believe the Moss unit might be more reliable, less noisy, and should be set up correctly out of the box. Fitment shouldn't be an issue as Moss has a kit specifically for this engine.

Either supercharger would add a serious amount of fun and both would score high on the grin-o-meter. I don't know if there'd be any significant difference between the two, performance wise.

The Judson has more 'neat' factor. The improvement in performance is modest (I had one for awhile).

The Moss unit is a nice bit of gear and better for performance.

I think I agree with Ralph - if you are after performance, you'd be tossing that original engine out anyway, not modifying it, and even if you do build a killer street MGB, the stock Miatas won't even notice you as they blow you off usng part throttle.

Don't go for performance, go for what best pleases you.

I did build a very nice MKII with a B 5main and all the trimmings, OD gearbox with the 4.1 and still not quite fast enough. So had to go to plan B and buy my MG SV-S to take care of those pesky Miatas.:D

Ron

Judson :thumbup:

Ralph you are showing your age when you say SIR instead of PIR! Great story by the way. Andy, compare the prices and your heart will tell you which one to pick up.

This one is a more efficient design than the moss one

http://www.hi-flow.com/HP2MGSuper.htm

http://www.hi-flow.com/HP5PicSuperB.htm

SV-S :eyepop:

Ron, I hate you.

Well...Actually I envy you...A lot!

How about some pics?

Rich

Thanks, I tried to keep with the spirit of the thread since the SV is supercharged but a Roush unit (stage 3+). Will see what I can do about a pic but dont want to hijack the thread.

Back to the orig post.

Andy

It is a personal choice, there are good reasons for both superchargers and there is no wrong answer.

Good luck.

Ron

I gotta million of them.

Andy.

To me, it's a pretty straight forward question.

If you are going to be driving limited miles and are looking for that "period" look and want to be unique. I'd go for the Judson.

It's an interesting bit of Americana and not something you see very often. There is a reason for that, as the Judson blowers did need some TLC and most were removed from service when the vanes or bearings started to get worn.

There are now good sources for replacement parts, so it is possible to rebuild a Judson to better than new condition since vane materials are now much better.

If you are planning on driving the car on a regular basis. I'd opt for the Moss supercharger.

It's pretty much a bolt on and forget it type of thing. When the bonnet is popped, it still looks like it belongs, but it's using modern belt drive, rotor design and bypass technology that are a far way beyond what the Judson can offer as far as drivability.

You might also check back issues of Classic Motorsport. I'm pretty sure that Carl Heideman did a side bar comparing his Judson blown MGA to his Moss blown MGB. I'm thinking his conclusions were pretty much the same as mine.

If it makes it any easier, you already have the wrong engine so why not the blower.

Ron

Thanks very much to everyone for your comments. It's all good stuff!

I think Kelvin hit the nail on the head for me. The Judson is very interesting for it's uniueness and retro-vibe. However, I drive my car as much as I can and I'm really starting to believe that for all the reasons mentioned, the Moss kit would be a better fit for me.

As for Ron's comment that my car already has the wrong engine, I whole heartedly disagree. It's not be the original engine, that's true, but the 1800 is most definitely the right engine for an MGA.

OK, probably a poor choice of words on my part, yes maybe not the original but a good choice for a motor.

Let us know how it turns out. Good Luck

Ron