MG MGB and MGB GT Tech Talk
when putting wire wheels back on and doing up the winged nut etc...do you put the car back on its own weight to do the final tightening..or do it while on jack...unsure when the big tighten should happen etc..thanks Charles
I always tighten while in the air. Placing the car on the ground introduces side load on the spinner. If the spinner is good and snug then final tightening on the ground is probably fine, but tightening in the air removes all doubt that the spinner is fully on and tight.
To prevent the wheel from spinning, just put your shoe against the tire, or use your free hand if you are brave. I prefer a foot so I can use both hands on the hammer handle. You can also lower the car just enough to put the tire on the ground but without full weight on it. On the rear wheels you can also use the hand brake.
Right, get the nut tight up into the taper with the wheel free to spin. Final tighten to be done with (at least the partial weight) of the vehicle to hold it against the hammer's torque...
thanks everyone..yes Steve..it was the side load I was concerned about..also that final tighten is quite forceful isnt it?...2 hands on the hammer etc
Out of all the owners manuals, the TR6 has the most descriptive detail.
"Slide the wheel on to the hub and while pushing against the wheel center to maintain concentric location, simultaneously screw on the retaining nut by hand until the wheel is felt to seat on the adapter taper.
Restraining the wheel with one hand, continue tightening, using the spanner (hammer). Lower the wheel to the ground and finally tighten."
This compares to the MGB, succinct. "Always jack up a wheel before using the hammer, and always hammer the nuts on tight."
The point is that the wheel needs to be fully seated to the hub taper, without the vehicle load. Then the final tightening is done with the wheel on the ground.
Charles, it should be tight, but not TOO tight. You don't want to distort the mating flange of the wheel hub. I only use two hands because I find it easier to guide the hammer, and avoid dinging the wheel arch. One hand is plenty of force to fully tighten the nut, providing your hammer is of decent weight.
Don't forget to check the nuts after the first drive to ensure they stayed tight. Not that I ever remember to do that, but kudos to those who do...
so...to undo the wheel it should be off the ground??to remove the load...thanks
I always do, for that reason. I find the spinner comes off easier when in the air, so there must be less side load. It won't hurt anything to try it both ways if you want to.
thanks Steve..very much appreciated...currently looking at your website re ideas for my garage!!
Charles
Stay tuned for a big update to the site, including the garage pages!
I always used to beat the crap out of the spinner to make sure it was on tight. I was really over doing it. One hand on the hammer, tighten in the air, and a few whacks after on the ground for good measure.
One question I've always had regarding knock offs, if not on tight enough can they undo themselves? I'm under the impression that they won't totally loosen up because of the direction of the threads and rotation of wheel.
Peter. If the tapers and the splines are in good condition, the wheel will stay in correct location without a lot of hammering. Once the seating surfaces start to wear though, the splines take more side loading and wear will be aggravated. When the splines are worn enough, they can fold over usually under braking, which is the highest front wheel loading. When this happens the knockoff will back off and the wheel can fall off. Over tightening a worn wheel and hub just delays the inevitable.
The theory has always been that a spinner self-tightens. I believe this is true in most situations, but don't trust my life to the possibility that there will be no exceptions. I've heard rumors of spinners which were not tightened enough coming off, and that's enough for me to not willingly tempt fate. Who knows, perhaps imbalance, oscillation, etc can render the self-tightening effect ineffectual.
My '67 owners manual says to tighten the spinners while the car is off of the ground. I have been following this procedure for 37 years and am still running on the original hub splines. I use a Thore copper/leather mallet and strike the spinners with a single hand. My only complaint is that over the years, due to a lack of concentration or such, I have hit and deformed a spoke or two. Use caution when hammering down the spinners or spoke replacement is in your future. RAY
The wheel should always be in the air. The wheel is centered by two tapers, one on the inside of the wheel which fits up against a similar taper on the inner side of the hub, and one on the outside which mates to a taper in the spinner. When the wheel is correctly installed, NONE of the weight is applied to the splines - they only transmit driving and braking forces.
If you lower the wheel before it is properly centered two things will happen - you will not get the spinner tight enough to center the wheel and,because for the first few miles the load is on the splines, you will get spline wear!
There is also no need to beat the crap out of the spinner to tighten it (there is a reason the "lugs" are that shape). Hit it until you see no significant movement - then stop. It WILL tighten itself as you drive - provided the majority of your driving is in the forward direction!
We ought to copy some commonly asked threads and just past the answers in when the same questions come up. I always hit the knockoff on tight while on the jack, then one final hit on the ground.
Careful, George. I tried collecting links to threads with commonly asked questions, to give to newbies when asking those questions. I got incredible amounts of grief from three different members for doing it! No good deed goes unpunished!
This thread would have made a good one to give to a newbie some day, but I think I'll let someone else try it. :eyeroll:
I certainly classify myself as a newbie...and find this thread MOST helpful thanks..Charles
Steve - I agree that a collection of "newbie" posts, or even answers to common questions is a great idea. My only caveat is that somebody needs to "review" the information to make sure it is accurate. Unfortunately, I see a lot of answers that appear to be guesses rather than informed advice - and some that are downright dangerous. In fact, some of the answers in this thread fall into that category!
Perhaps a seperate "Common Question" forum that has a couple of knowledgable moderators would be a solution?
I agree with that Eric, but the problem is that no one will ever agree on who should review and approve the information. There will always be those who disagree with a thread whether it's correct or not. That's why I started collecting links to every thread on a particular subject, so long as the thread contained primarily on-topic information. Problem is, anyone who disagreed with the general consensus of the forum accused me of posting only links that I personally agreed with. So the only way to make this work is to simply tell someone to search for themselves, and spend 20 minutes to find the same threads that could have been given to them in a single post. Oh well.
Nice...you have a source for those? Will it work on 2-eared knock-offs?
Here is the link for SR manufacturing.
knockoff spinner tool by SR manufacturing
I agree, tighten in the air to let the tapers take up. I do give one final snug-up on the ground. No need to beat the knock-offs into oblivion; they have left and right sided threads for a reason.
I use this tool to look after my (Australian made, stainless steel) knock-offs. (i.e. "spinners")
Tom, that appears to be made of a much better wood than the typical cheap plywood things for sale. Let us know how it holds up over time!
Stainless steel knockoffs? I wish I had a set of those beauties holding my Dayton chrome wire wheels on. I tighten the knockoffs in the air, then hammer them tight in the air just as the manual that came with my '67 states. It has been working for me and the car for 37 years. I'm still running the original hubs front and rear with no noticable wear or freeplay. RAY
Here's a photo of a couple of the stainless steel knockoffs. They are a little dearer than the chrome plated items, but these will see you and the car out with no further attention. They are available from "Sportsparts" in Normanhurst, Sydney, although the proprietor, Bruce Smith was considering discontinuing carrying them, as the price was creeping up to a point where they were no longer selling.
A pity. They are works of art. A set of these would outlast the car. Much stronger than the brass units that they replace. No chroming process today can match the luster of stainless. RAY
I always use a lead hammer. There is no damage to the spinner while using one. Their not pretty to look at, (the hammer), after they've been used a few times, but I'd rather replace hammers than spinners. I pull my wheels off the 72 to clean them before a show and my spinners, which get beat on a lot, still look like new. Oh yeah, the factory recommended keeping the car off the ground while tightening the wheels.
